EVE Search - New drones, modules and what not

Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 42 post(s)
Luc Boye	Posted - 2005.10.31 16:17:00 - [1] Originally by: Istmar Hi'ma Edited by: Istmar Hi''ma on 31/10/2005 14:35:07 Tuxford, what in Tomb's hell are you doing? These new drones will make Gals the end all of ships period. Sure other ship can use drones, but not as effective as a Gal ship. The Domi is already the "Do Almost Everything Ship," now (with these changes) it really will be the "Do Everything Ship." Oh man, just think of the Moa with its +5 drone bonus...The end of Eve is at hand! Actually, this is nerf to drone ships, since they lack any form of offensive weps except the drones. In that they were unique. Whatever was unique with gallente is lost now that geddon can have EW drones as well.
Luc Boye Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2005.10.31 16:17:00 - [2] Originally by: Istmar Hi'ma Edited by: Istmar Hi''ma on 31/10/2005 14:35:07 Tuxford, what in Tomb's hell are you doing? These new drones will make Gals the end all of ships period. Sure other ship can use drones, but not as effective as a Gal ship. The Domi is already the "Do Almost Everything Ship," now (with these changes) it really will be the "Do Everything Ship." Oh man, just think of the Moa with its +5 drone bonus...The end of Eve is at hand! Actually, this is nerf to drone ships, since they lack any form of offensive weps except the drones. In that they were unique. Whatever was unique with gallente is lost now that geddon can have EW drones as well. ---
Luc Boye	Posted - 2005.10.31 16:22:00 - [3] Edited by: Luc Boye on 31/10/2005 16:22:27 Originally by: Jim Raynor Hilarious how all you guys say that giving Caldari ships with a Kinetic Missile Damage bonus a bonus to all damage types would be insanely unfair, but now CCP slaps the same restraint on Gallante ships and everyones looking to call in the WAAAAAAAMBULANCE. I think these changes are good, one of my biggest complaints about the kinetic only damage bonus for Caldari was the fact a ship like the Ishtar could do even more DPS than a scourge spewing Cerberus + choose any damage type on top of that.. and run a powerful tank setup.... and electronic warfare........ and nosferatu........ ya that's a real balanced ship right there folks. Not really champ. Cerberus has 400 missiles of each type in his hold. It can spam any type of damage with all launchers after switching ammo. Ishtar has 20 drones in bay and can release 15. So your dmg type choice is fixed, unless you consider redocking and swapping drones between 2 engagements an option. If I put 5 of each type in drone bay, my choice of dmg type is still worse then cerb simply reloading the right missile type.
Luc Boye Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2005.10.31 16:22:00 - [4] Edited by: Luc Boye on 31/10/2005 16:22:27 Originally by: Jim Raynor Hilarious how all you guys say that giving Caldari ships with a Kinetic Missile Damage bonus a bonus to all damage types would be insanely unfair, but now CCP slaps the same restraint on Gallante ships and everyones looking to call in the WAAAAAAAMBULANCE. I think these changes are good, one of my biggest complaints about the kinetic only damage bonus for Caldari was the fact a ship like the Ishtar could do even more DPS than a scourge spewing Cerberus + choose any damage type on top of that.. and run a powerful tank setup.... and electronic warfare........ and nosferatu........ ya that's a real balanced ship right there folks. Not really champ. Cerberus has 400 missiles of each type in his hold. It can spam any type of damage with all launchers after switching ammo. Ishtar has 20 drones in bay and can release 15. So your dmg type choice is fixed, unless you consider redocking and swapping drones between 2 engagements an option. If I put 5 of each type in drone bay, my choice of dmg type is still worse then cerb simply reloading the right missile type. ---
Luc Boye	Posted - 2005.10.31 16:36:00 - [5] Also wtf is that about "were upping the HP of drones"? The time it takes to kill drones is not about "breaking their tank" lol, its about killing 15 of them, due to targeting time, max target count, etc. So 5 drones die faster then 15 still. Sucks to be ishtar then. Or dominix. Or moros. Oh, and btw: WTS ishtar & dominix.
Luc Boye Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2005.10.31 16:36:00 - [6] Also wtf is that about "were upping the HP of drones"? The time it takes to kill drones is not about "breaking their tank" lol, its about killing 15 of them, due to targeting time, max target count, etc. So 5 drones die faster then 15 still. Sucks to be ishtar then. Or dominix. Or moros. Oh, and btw: WTS ishtar & dominix. ---
Luc Boye	Posted - 2005.10.31 16:38:00 - [7] Originally by: Nafri its just that gallante will finally also suffer when choosing damage, like matari and like caldari Like caldari? Lol suffer what?` Raven: Special Ability: 5% bonus to Cruise and Siege Launcher Rate Of Fire and 10% bonus to Cruise Missile and Torpedo Velocity per level. Again, what are you suffering when switching missile type?
Luc Boye Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2005.10.31 16:38:00 - [8] Originally by: Nafri its just that gallante will finally also suffer when choosing damage, like matari and like caldari Like caldari? Lol suffer what?` Raven: Special Ability: 5% bonus to Cruise and Siege Launcher Rate Of Fire and 10% bonus to Cruise Missile and Torpedo Velocity per level. Again, what are you suffering when switching missile type? ---
Luc Boye	Posted - 2005.10.31 16:44:00 - [9] Originally by: Jim Raynor Originally by: Luc Boye Originally by: Nafri its just that gallante will finally also suffer when choosing damage, like matari and like caldari Like caldari? Lol suffer what?` Raven: Special Ability: 5% bonus to Cruise and Siege Launcher Rate Of Fire and 10% bonus to Cruise Missile and Torpedo Velocity per level. Again, what are you suffering when switching missile type? Good luck fitting all those damage types in a 665m3 Cargo hold when you can hold ~1k Torpedoes tops.. the velocity bonus is a fairly dubious bonus for Ravens considering they are only powerful with short range torpedo setups. Oooooh, you mean like good luck fitting all those cap charges you need for blasterthron to break ravens tank? I understand now, thanks Jim.
Luc Boye Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2005.10.31 16:44:00 - [10] Originally by: Jim Raynor Originally by: Luc Boye Originally by: Nafri its just that gallante will finally also suffer when choosing damage, like matari and like caldari Like caldari? Lol suffer what?` Raven: Special Ability: 5% bonus to Cruise and Siege Launcher Rate Of Fire and 10% bonus to Cruise Missile and Torpedo Velocity per level. Again, what are you suffering when switching missile type? Good luck fitting all those damage types in a 665m3 Cargo hold when you can hold ~1k Torpedoes tops.. the velocity bonus is a fairly dubious bonus for Ravens considering they are only powerful with short range torpedo setups. Oooooh, you mean like good luck fitting all those cap charges you need for blasterthron to break ravens tank? I understand now, thanks Jim. ---
Luc Boye	Posted - 2005.10.31 16:51:00 - [11] Originally by: Nafri lala, my point is still valid No its not, the only thing you're valid about is that you can sing "lala". Good thing I have 2 mil in missiles too.
Luc Boye Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2005.10.31 16:51:00 - [12] Originally by: Nafri lala, my point is still valid No its not, the only thing you're valid about is that you can sing "lala". Good thing I have 2 mil in missiles too. ---
Luc Boye	Posted - 2005.10.31 17:03:00 - [13] Originally by: Jim Raynor Quote: Caldari, only the kestrel/crow/cara/cerb are forced to choose dmg type to get high DPS. The rest of their ships have the same limitations of all other races, except the raven, which can choose whatever damage type it fancies and still gets full dmg. Probably the most versatile of ALL ships when choosing damage The only other ship when you remove kes/crow/caracal/cerb is the Raven.. this is a battleship that can be tanked by an AF.. very rarely do torpedoes inflict full damage on anything.. it's only versatile in changing damage if you have an industrial in tow because carrying 1k torps is very limiting, of course EM + Explosive are probably the only torpedoes worth carrying, since they are the best for PvP. Quote: And then theres minmatar. All minmatar ships can chose their dmg type and get their bonuses as they are all ROF + DMG. Only race specific i can think of is breacher + stealth bomber, which arent exactly widely used, and when they are they get explosive dmg which is the best dmg in PVP imo. I think it's lame the highest grade (and mostly used?) Minmatar ammunition does mostly EM damage.. honestly shouldn't the most used Minmatar ammo use Explosive? Perhaps Minmatar ammo should be altered a bit. I don't think Minmatar can really switch damage types in a true sense.. I find it ironic that Amarr T2 ships are the most suspectible to thermal damage when there's phased plasma ammo and it's only second to EMP in damage.. You know Jim, I'll start reading your arguments when a module called "missile tracking disruptor" is in game, and dont even mention defenders. Until then, don't take it personal.
Luc Boye Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2005.10.31 17:03:00 - [14] Originally by: Jim Raynor Quote: Caldari, only the kestrel/crow/cara/cerb are forced to choose dmg type to get high DPS. The rest of their ships have the same limitations of all other races, except the raven, which can choose whatever damage type it fancies and still gets full dmg. Probably the most versatile of ALL ships when choosing damage The only other ship when you remove kes/crow/caracal/cerb is the Raven.. this is a battleship that can be tanked by an AF.. very rarely do torpedoes inflict full damage on anything.. it's only versatile in changing damage if you have an industrial in tow because carrying 1k torps is very limiting, of course EM + Explosive are probably the only torpedoes worth carrying, since they are the best for PvP. Quote: And then theres minmatar. All minmatar ships can chose their dmg type and get their bonuses as they are all ROF + DMG. Only race specific i can think of is breacher + stealth bomber, which arent exactly widely used, and when they are they get explosive dmg which is the best dmg in PVP imo. I think it's lame the highest grade (and mostly used?) Minmatar ammunition does mostly EM damage.. honestly shouldn't the most used Minmatar ammo use Explosive? Perhaps Minmatar ammo should be altered a bit. I don't think Minmatar can really switch damage types in a true sense.. I find it ironic that Amarr T2 ships are the most suspectible to thermal damage when there's phased plasma ammo and it's only second to EMP in damage.. You know Jim, I'll start reading your arguments when a module called "missile tracking disruptor" is in game, and dont even mention defenders. Until then, don't take it personal. ---
Luc Boye	Posted - 2005.10.31 17:16:00 - [15] Edited by: Luc Boye on 31/10/2005 17:16:30 Originally by: Jim Raynor Yeah, cause missiles are so uber, PvP is so dominated by missile ships. WTS Clue, care to make an offer Luc? Hop on to sisi and check out what is the #1 ship people use for 1v1. A tip: its not a turret ship. There, you got your clue for free.
Luc Boye Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2005.10.31 17:16:00 - [16] Edited by: Luc Boye on 31/10/2005 17:16:30 Originally by: Jim Raynor Yeah, cause missiles are so uber, PvP is so dominated by missile ships. WTS Clue, care to make an offer Luc? Hop on to sisi and check out what is the #1 ship people use for 1v1. A tip: its not a turret ship. There, you got your clue for free. ---
Luc Boye	Posted - 2005.10.31 23:29:00 - [17] Originally by: Nafri ohh easily, just make it: 6x Ion II 1x XL CL5 2x Ward 1x Warp disruptor 1x Quad Lif 5x MFS II 1x PDU II 1x CPU II DPS: 716.186, without drones! Including Drones: 1070.111 Yeah, Im really crying for the poor Dominix, a tanked close range pwnmobile... Haha, bs that flies like a brick for close range...
Luc Boye Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2005.10.31 23:29:00 - [18] Originally by: Nafri ohh easily, just make it: 6x Ion II 1x XL CL5 2x Ward 1x Warp disruptor 1x Quad Lif 5x MFS II 1x PDU II 1x CPU II DPS: 716.186, without drones! Including Drones: 1070.111 Yeah, Im really crying for the poor Dominix, a tanked close range pwnmobile... Haha, bs that flies like a brick for close range... ---
Luc Boye	Posted - 2005.11.01 07:45:00 - [19] Originally by: Jim Raynor For those who say the Dominix sucks with guns, I hear nothing but good things about the 6 d250mm Railgun 7 Mag Stab II setups.. granted a dmg module stack nerf is forthcoming but for right now the setup is rather pwntastic I am told. Go fire a missile. Leave turret ships to those that use them.
Luc Boye Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2005.11.01 07:45:00 - [20] Originally by: Jim Raynor For those who say the Dominix sucks with guns, I hear nothing but good things about the 6 d250mm Railgun 7 Mag Stab II setups.. granted a dmg module stack nerf is forthcoming but for right now the setup is rather pwntastic I am told. Go fire a missile. Leave turret ships to those that use them. ---
Luc Boye	Posted - 2005.11.01 21:30:00 - [21] Originally by: Jim Raynor Quote: Because for missiles it was a bonus. For the drones, it is just keeping them up to par with the damage that they do now. In effect, the +1 drone per level and the 10% extra damage per level is the same bonus. No one complained when they got an extra drone per level. Cerberus: Max Skills (heavy missile spec 4) 5 Heavy Launcher II w/ non scourge = 135.7 DPS 5 Heavy Launcher II w/ scourge = 169.6 DPS Ishtar: Max Skills 15(5) Ogre II = 396 DPS Considering heavy missile launcher IIs actually take fitting, the Cerberus looks rather pathetic straight out of the box, adding 4 faction ballistics will get you in the 325 DPS ballpark.. still less than an Ishtar who justs puts drones in his bay and sends them at you. Good luck fitting those t2 ballistics, 40 cpu pretty much ruins your setups, which were hardly overpowering to begin with, thanks CCP. So really, throwing the Caldari that 5% all missile damage bone, wouldn't exactly imbalance much, considering the pathetic DPS of launchers at the moment. While this certainly isn't a missile thread, I just find it lame that Gallente and their stupid drones might have been balanced out a bit, and they too would have to deal with racial constraints just like Caldari ships must deal with, but it seems CCP would rather just put that burden on Caldari ships and no one else, well, whatever. drone range is also greater then cerberus range... oh wait, it isnt.
Luc Boye Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2005.11.01 21:30:00 - [22] Originally by: Jim Raynor Quote: Because for missiles it was a bonus. For the drones, it is just keeping them up to par with the damage that they do now. In effect, the +1 drone per level and the 10% extra damage per level is the same bonus. No one complained when they got an extra drone per level. Cerberus: Max Skills (heavy missile spec 4) 5 Heavy Launcher II w/ non scourge = 135.7 DPS 5 Heavy Launcher II w/ scourge = 169.6 DPS Ishtar: Max Skills 15(5) Ogre II = 396 DPS Considering heavy missile launcher IIs actually take fitting, the Cerberus looks rather pathetic straight out of the box, adding 4 faction ballistics will get you in the 325 DPS ballpark.. still less than an Ishtar who justs puts drones in his bay and sends them at you. Good luck fitting those t2 ballistics, 40 cpu pretty much ruins your setups, which were hardly overpowering to begin with, thanks CCP. So really, throwing the Caldari that 5% all missile damage bone, wouldn't exactly imbalance much, considering the pathetic DPS of launchers at the moment. While this certainly isn't a missile thread, I just find it lame that Gallente and their stupid drones might have been balanced out a bit, and they too would have to deal with racial constraints just like Caldari ships must deal with, but it seems CCP would rather just put that burden on Caldari ships and no one else, well, whatever. drone range is also greater then cerberus range... oh wait, it isnt. ---
Luc Boye	Posted - 2005.11.01 21:32:00 - [23] Edited by: Luc Boye on 01/11/2005 21:33:15 Also, when cerberus is about to get scrambled it can warp off, but unfortunately it leaves its launchers behind... oh wait it doesn't. And so on.
Luc Boye Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2005.11.01 21:32:00 - [24] Edited by: Luc Boye on 01/11/2005 21:33:15 Also, when cerberus is about to get scrambled it can warp off, but unfortunately it leaves its launchers behind... oh wait it doesn't. And so on. ---
Luc Boye	Posted - 2005.11.01 21:52:00 - [25] Well, ok, that whole smartbomb issue about drones is not really that big of a deal. What I am saying is that most people dont have smartbombs on, since that extra high slot is much more useful when you fit nos there. So I gotta agree with my arch-nemesis Mr. Raynor about that one. However drones are still not that hot deal, even if they do look great on paper. For example, most hacs can run circles around ishtar and shoot drones at leisure while scrambling for +1. If you dont web someone right away in ishtar you are not going to kill anything, so at best its a stand off. At worst they shoot your drones and then you die. As for the whole logistics of drones, and drone interface (still buggy after 2.5 years) it just sucks. You really gotta fly a drone ship to understand why. This whole argument is like ppl whinging about how much dps 7xmodal neutron + 7 dmg mods megathron does (Nafri) as in "everybody flies ships like that everyday, right?". What works in practice is Raven chunking torps at you, geddon melting you from 30 k in 15 secs, megathron and tempests sniping ppl off, etc. Selective paper comparisons are just bollox.
Luc Boye Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2005.11.01 21:52:00 - [26] Well, ok, that whole smartbomb issue about drones is not really that big of a deal. What I am saying is that most people dont have smartbombs on, since that extra high slot is much more useful when you fit nos there. So I gotta agree with my arch-nemesis Mr. Raynor about that one. However drones are still not that hot deal, even if they do look great on paper. For example, most hacs can run circles around ishtar and shoot drones at leisure while scrambling for +1. If you dont web someone right away in ishtar you are not going to kill anything, so at best its a stand off. At worst they shoot your drones and then you die. As for the whole logistics of drones, and drone interface (still buggy after 2.5 years) it just sucks. You really gotta fly a drone ship to understand why. This whole argument is like ppl whinging about how much dps 7xmodal neutron + 7 dmg mods megathron does (Nafri) as in "everybody flies ships like that everyday, right?". What works in practice is Raven chunking torps at you, geddon melting you from 30 k in 15 secs, megathron and tempests sniping ppl off, etc. Selective paper comparisons are just bollox. ---
Luc Boye	Posted - 2005.11.01 22:21:00 - [27] Also drone interface sucks today, I liked the old one where you opened the drone bay in same way as cargo bay. You could have it open and minimized. Now if I want to launch a particular drone, I have to resize my overview and scroll there, which is highly impractical, since I need my overview for other things. Drone bay has nothing to do with overview tbh.
Luc Boye Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2005.11.01 22:21:00 - [28] Also drone interface sucks today, I liked the old one where you opened the drone bay in same way as cargo bay. You could have it open and minimized. Now if I want to launch a particular drone, I have to resize my overview and scroll there, which is highly impractical, since I need my overview for other things. Drone bay has nothing to do with overview tbh. ---

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